The Deception of Desteni’s Self Honesty

If you haven’t come across Desteni before, you might think WTF? I certainly did. However, after looking into them for the last half year, I can assure you that these people make the Libertarian National Socialist Green Party look like the fucking girl scouts. Anyway, there are plenty of other youtube channels that go into describing them. Here are a few:

http://www.youtube.com/user/0rdoTempliAurora
http://www.youtube.com/user/Istenenergia
http://www.youtube.com/user/L0sMuertos
http://www.youtube.com/user/antidestenimovement
http://www.youtube.com/user/freespeech4tw

But in this vid I’m going to focus on a particular aspect of Desteni. Desteni makes grandiose overtures concerning its principals. In this vlog I intend to focus on Desteni’s concept of Self-Honesty. If I refer to another video or document you can find a link to it in the description. While at times I will try and maintain objectivity, at other times I will not. Some Destonians might claim that Im being mean or nasty. However, that is quite fine. They can remain behind their desteni bubble while crying boohoo she is a mean girl! At least in this case their AntiFuck videos might very well be justified.

Desteni loves to paint itself with lofty ideals and concepts. It holds itself above the rest of the world which it views as abusive, cruel, and pernicious. Desteni claims it is advocating equality and oneness. However, the proof is in the pudding not in what it looks like. But, the Desteni crowd certainly stylizes itself along certain lines in order to appeal to certain kinds of people. You can see this when you watch various videos of theirs. For example pay attention to the types of music they always pick in order to introduce their vids. I don’t know about you, but I always think of newage synth pop or some other form of bland shit. But, maybe in Self-honesty I should examine why I think that. Is it because I have been programmed with judgments? Am I judging Desteni’s use of manipulation in order to sell their product? You’re damn right! These judgments are what keep me from buying shitty movie licensed console games.  Also, notice the different forms of imagery they typically use in order to evoke certain feelings in the viewer. For example, check you GainAntiHate’s video Question to desteni followers about self forgiveness - Anti Hate. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DobVEQMomfU 

He uses imagery of being all one with nature, his pet gecko, and fuckin praying mantis. If I didn’t know any better, I would have thought he just joined the Hari Krishnas. I wonder how many hours a day he typically spends doing this. Or did he just do it in order to make himself look like he was mr harmony? Hey Gain! Next time show me your equality and oneness by letting a funnelweb spider crawl on your bald noggin – how about that? Maybe then you’ll be a little more convincing. But, somehow I don’t think you will.

I’m gonna use imagery and music too. But I’m going to be really honest. I don’t pretend to be good and speaking from some horseshit standpoint of equality and oneness. I don’t give two shits about equality and solutions. I’m an evil reptile woman. I’m a closet nazi in the sense that I have a fetish for the uniforms and paraphernalia but not so much the philosophy. Although survival of the fittest and might makes right does make me all fuzzy and warm inside. The only way I like a man is if he licking the bottom of my boot. And as a misanthrope I generally think most people are scum. I don’t care about subs, and friends and whatever youtube yummy feel good feeling is flying around. mmmmK? Nuf said.

Of all of Desteni’s claims, perhaps the most alluring and captivating is their assertion that they are working within the confines of Self-Honesty in order to bring to the rest of the world what is best for all. Destonians often extoll Self-Honesty as something far worthier than normal honesty. When in disagreement with another party, Destonians often fall back upon the notion that the other party is speaking from a foundation which lacks Self-Honesty. As a result, Desteni’s Honesty is given the clothing of appearing more virtuous and therefore more worthy. Those who utilize it become irrefutable and intractable in their claims. However, have they really found or discovered a principal that is more righteous than just normal honesty?

Maya Herel writes the following in her blog concerning an example of a potential love interest:

[QUOTE]Self honesty would be to first ‘Stop’, and investigate how and why I’ve created those feelings in the first place. What is it that the other guy activated within me? how is that I’ve accepted and allowed myself to create the feelings and the emotions specifically towards this other guy? What this other guy symbolize to me? And then I would go and investigate why am I allowing myself to think that I’m honest by sharing that? What I’m excepting to get. And then most likely I would see that my starting point was manipulation because I wanted something from this guy, I wanted this guy to give me energy, to fulfill me, to feel loved. And I expect that if I share myself honestly, the other guy would response to it as I would like him to response and when he does, I’ll experience good and positive energy.

So basically, my starting point is manipulating another within the belief that I’m honest about that so that I would get what I want – which is energy.{END QUOTE]

 http://desteni.co.za/profile/21/post/3794

Oh good God! Fuck me gently with a chainsaw! Maya you sound like a born again tickle me emo doll.

However, couldn’t Maya in self honesty come to the conclusion that even though two people could be participating in something out of selfish desires or needs that both parties could benefit? On the one hand it is good that she made herself more aware of what is going on behind the scenes. However, her example fails to take into regard the other participant (the guy). Surely he is acting in a similar manner and for similar reasons. Could not both parties gain something from the experience and the sharing? Maya seems only to be able to consider the scene from a negative context. Would it not have been better if the girl in her example continued to participate in the activity but with more awareness of the emotional pitfalls and underlying desires? Instead in her example, she simply writes the entire scene off as something negative and worthy of no participation at all.

Also, couldn’t Maya apply this example to other situations? How about friendship? Do not people often enter into such relationships based upon certain wants and expectations? On the one hand, possessing insight and consciousness of one’s judgments and expectations could help an individual to form real and lasting relationships, rather than ones that are based simply upon identity or projections. However, why does Desteni blacklist and generalize such behaviors? Are all such relationships grounded in deception and some form of Desteni brand evil? Also, is not Desteni guilty of the same behavior?

Do Destonians not form their online relationships with other Destonians based upon a new identity and new projections? Is not Desteni feeding off the same energy in order to perpetuate itself? How is that Destonians are not simply participating in yet another form of deception? Are they not deriving some form of energy from their need to participate in the Desteni group? If Desteni truly did what it claims to do then should not these people, many of whom have been participating in the group for several years now, be able process themselves outside of the centralized Desteni mind construct? I guess not. I guess if I was a cult retard Id want some old bald weirdo who dresses up like an anthropomorphic turd monster telling me what to do too.

Maya continues:

[QUOTE]Another example is- I was seeing a point within myself where I was mean towards another or spiteful towards another and I hurt the person by doing something to him. Then I would investigate the point for myself and apply Self Forgiveness and I have saw what I’ve participated within and then, I would go to the other person and honestly share the point with the other person but the truth is that I’m only seeking for the other person’s forgiveness. I want him to see that I’ve changed so he won’t any longer be mad at me. And I’m seeking for his approval/validation of me. So my starting point of sharing with the other person isn’t honesty but actually deception because again, I’m looking for something from the other person – either forgiveness or that he would think that I’m good and positive person instead of walking through a point and when it’s done, it’s done. That’s it. you’re not require for anyone approval of you. Self honesty would be the understanding that no one can forgive you but Self Forgive.[END QUOTE]

In this example, Maya seems to disregard whether or not she has actually caused the other person injury. How would forgiving yourself correct such patterns of behavior? If Maya uses Self-Forgiveness but seeks no reconciliation with the other party, what good has been accomplished? Also, why is seeking forgiveness from another always deceptive and only for seeking validation? Do people ever seek forgiveness for wholly selfless reasons? I personally don’t but I don’t exclude the possibility that someone else might.

Allow me to use my own example to retort: There are two young women who are friends. One is called Diana and the other is named Julia. Julia has a boyfriend but Diana does not. Diana is jealous of Julia’s relationship with her boyfriend. As a result, Diana spreads some harmful rumors in order to act out her jealousy. These rumors have a profound affect and cause Julia to break up with her boyfriend. Later, Diana regrets her actions and the harm that has been done. She goes to Julia and explains her actions and asks for forgiveness. How does Diana know that she will get validation from Julia? Does not the risk that Julia will react badly to Diana’s confession still exist? Is positive energy always the reward from such undertakings? Will Diana experience validation if Julia reacts angrily? Would Diana wish instead that she had never told Julia the truth? And despite these questions we could still elevate the discussion to yet another level.

What if Diana had found Desteni after the fact? In this alternative, Diana undergoes self forgiveness and alleviates the pains of guilt in this manner. Diana then decides to encourage Julia to participate in Desteni so that she too can experience self forgiveness and thereby undue the pain her breakup caused. However, Julia is not receptive to the Desteni message and instead grows more distant from Diana. Julia instead comes to view Desteni as a cult which has stolen her friend away. In Self-Honesty, how was best for all served here? Instead of creating a bridge of communication the two parties have now entrenched themselves in their views. Diana may have denied herself the feeling of guilt, but Julia is still reacting and dealing with the pain from her loss. In this case, not only has Julia lost her boyfriend but she has lost her relationship with Diana without being given any choice in the matter.

Finally, has Diana the Destonian really extracted herself from participating in self deception? Or has she received validation from her new identity and group relationship through her participation in Desteni? Is the Desteni Process not giving her another form of validation? Has she simply traded one lie for yet another lie? And even though one might seek forgiveness from another for merely selfish desires, was the action not beneficial to the other party? Are not both parties seeking some form of reconciliation in order to acclimate further communication and understanding? What is so harmful in seeking to rectify or undue harm caused in such a situation? Perhaps if Maya could be more specific in her example, her point could be made all the more clear.

In Bernard Poolman’s video on the subject of Self-Honesty, he discusses how we are taught and programed with honesty to the system. And by the system here I’m guessing he means everything but Desteni. Bernard goes on explaining that normal honesty has created poverty, starvation and war. He claims that people who acted in sefl-honesty but acted against the system have been branded as criminals. In other words criminals are individuals who did not act honestly to the system. Poolman provides us with an example of person who steals food to feed his family is acting in Self-honesty.

Well Mr Poolman, your example forgets about the other programming you have received from the same system. Your culture is embedded with Robin Hood type stories of people defending the starving masses. And on the contrary I think a normal human would turn a blind eye to such a kind of thief. Most people, I’m sure, and who were aware of the thief’s condition of stealing to feed their family would treat the situation with compassion. However, perhaps you are referring to yourself in the example. Perhaps you are the thief who is trying to feed his family? However, you are not stealing from the system. You have simply duped others into working for you and then into giving you their money. If that is their desire then so be it. It only proves what fools they are and not you. As for yourself, you are simply willing to take advantage of their condition in order to feed yourself and your family. Quite an audacious scheme you have cooked up and one that is worthy of praise from a reptilian such as myself.

Also, your example concerning using self honesty is elementary at best and just fucking kindergarten at worst. It seems that Desteni only knows how to show off its self honesty with simple moral quandaries. Tell me Mr Poolmonster, what would your self honest answer be to this dilemma?

[See Science of Evil Clip]

Poolman claims that old fashioned honesty is driven by guilt and that actual self-honesty has nothing to do with guilt. However, in my time of observing Desteni, I have seen cases of guilt being used to pressure those within Desteni and those outside of Desteni. Do you or do you not use guilt in order to try and silence your critics? They are after all criticizing what is best for all are they not? And should they not feel guilt for doing so? Also what about members in Desteni who question you or the Winged one? Have you not employed guilt upon these people in order to maintain your position within the Desteni hierarchy? This simply seems to be yet another contradiction on your part? Is there something special about contradicting yourself all the time? I wonder.

Poolman continues by telling Destonians that they should be acting in the interest of the group (in other words Desteni) that stands for what is best for all. I say Desteni here since this seems to be the group you are referring to. Or are there any other groups that are acting in the interest of what is best for all? Wouldn’t Self-honesty mandate that you work with other groups who are working along similar lines in order to truly do what is best for all? One would think so but you have gone out of your way to malign other such groups. You have spoken against Zeitgeist and the Venus Project on numerous occasions have you not? You have condemned lightworkers as being ineffectual while offering no real examples of how you are more effective than they are.

And what about the Basic Income Grant? If what is best for all is best served by working with others, wouldn’t it make common sense to participate with other groups who are also advancing the Basic Income Grant? On the one hand you claim that using the tools of the system in order to defeat the system is justified. However, how is working with other groups along similar lines worse? Sadly, your attention to this detail seems negligent. However, perhaps this is exactly your intention. Besides we surely couldn’t have cult members associating with other cults or groups. Because then their attention might become focused on something besides yourself and Desteni correct?

Furthermore, Poolman frames everyday honesty concerning doubt and fear as not being real. He claims that real self-honesty requires real action even if no one is present to see it. So in this regard Poolman upholds selfhonesty as being distinct from regular honesty due to it having a real consequence or impact. I’m sorry but which real action are you referring to? Are you referring to the act of shaving ones head for equality and oneness? Are referring to donations to Desteni and yourself as a consequence? Are you referring to self writing and vlogging about  ones own indoctrinating loyalty process to the Desteni Mind Construct? Which real action are you talking about?

Anyway, he encourages Destonians to vlog and write about self-honesty so they can understand it properly. From a cult indoctrinating perspective this makes sense. Desteni’s selfhonesty seems confusing at first. In order to push this confusion and doubt away, it makes common sense that Poolman would want his Destonians to continually repeat the consumption of his wisdom and understanding. Any deviation of agreement to the material would be an indication of disloyalty to the group, coming from ego, and therefore invalid. He then asserts that this has never been done before and offers the proof as being the world in its current condition of starvation and poverty. Well Mr Poolman its being done now isn’t it? Why haven’t you changed the world yet with your avant-garde message? Why isn’t anything getting done now? Why do you continually cripple the efforts of what is best for all? Or perhaps your wisdom and spirituality is yet another failed religion in a world replete with failed religions? Why don’t you ask yourself these questions in self-honesty? Why don’t you answer you critics directly without getting your followers to do it for you? You know why? I’ll tell you why. The simple answer is is that you’re a coward.

In one of Spamann’s examples she uses the concept of love. She claims that someone could be honest by saying that they are in love with someone. But in selfhonesty the person examines why they are in love. Therefore, selfhonesty is going much deeper and far further than normal honesty. In her view, self honesty is the sure method  for uncovering the truth and for being able to sift through the programs and lies. But, this seems more of a careless and non critical answer of how certain processes in human minds work.

[See Yale Psychology Course Clip]

Therefore, here is my observation. I think Spamann and many others in Desteni, lack the capacity to utilize the unconscious areas within their minds to properly detect BS. I would say that many are mentally deficient in this regard. I have read over numerous examples of Destonian testimony indicating that many of them have fallen for one scam and then have moved on only to become victims of yet another. Even LLCraver before coming to Desteni had a history of falling victim to similar forms of horseshit. Therefore, in order to cover up their deficiency, they have latched onto this concept of Self-Honesty in order to cover it up and hide it. And since Destonians use self honesty their utilization of such a concept allows them to put their experiences and beliefs on a higher pedestal than the rest of us.

Furthermore, I would like to ask Spamann as to the nature of her experiences with love? What forms of love are you familiar with Spamann? Warning rant incoming.  In your example, are you referring to some boy with a turgid penis you have just met on the internet or something else? In selfhonesty, who in the hell programmed you to think that these boys were feeling love and not lust? Therefore, aren’t your experiences with sexual love jaded by your experiences with young men around your age? While someone might claim love for you, love in itself is more than a mere statement. Love is only real when it is expressed through action. Did someone express love for you through real action or were you just too frightened of his penis and automatically disregard and blacklisted him as being motivated by rape?

And what about other forms of love? How about the love a parent feels for a child? Do you think the love a parent demonstrates for her child is equally worthless? Do you think that your parents would have gone through the trouble of clothing you and feeding and raising you out of some selfish and manipulative desire? Is your own personal family seriously this fucked up? I seriously doubt you have had enough experience with love in order to make such a broad sweeping statement. Also, how have those within Desteni expressed something to you that is far worthier than something as manipulative and selfish as love? If I was you, I would examine in self honesty why you participate in Desteni. Have you become more self effective and free through Desteni or have you simply become dependant upon Desteni? Do you not seek and are attached to the attention of your fellow Destoniains and viewers on youtube? Do you not react and place judgements on others through your Structural Alignment Programming and Desteni Mind Consciousness System? When will you learn to think for yourself rather just parading around on youtube with your look at my sweaty ass but be sure to cut off your dick attitude? Or are you content to continue playing the part of Desteni airhead? Probably the latter.

Look at yourself selfhonestly. Are you or are you not presenting an image of yourself as being this holier than thou Desteni Princess full of equality and oneness while deriving self-fulfilling energy from the attention you create? How long are you planning to uphold the martyrdom of your pretty long hair for the cause of equality and oneness as something more noble than most? You say that you are overcoming the beauty system but in fact you are hypnotized by it. You have not overcome it. In self honesty you are simply pissed off because you couldn’t meet the expectations of the fashion industry. And now you simply express your whininess through Desteni. Are you and the other Destonian girls going to prostitute yourselves in other ways to increase the Desteni head count? Oh Im sorry Spamann am I being mean? Well in that case I suggest you try not reacting and looking through my spitefulness! And don’t you worry, I’ll be sure and self forgive myself for allowing myself to be spiteful towards you. I would never beg forgiveness from such a moron like you.

Spamann further claims that within, humans are all the same. Humans all have the same constructs and the same programs running despite various outward differences. The foundation of each person is the same but with different outflows. She asks the viewer to consider their participation in whatever they are doing but to ask oneself why he or she is participating in such a thing. This seems more of an excuse to get the viewer to question why they are participating in something outside of Desteni.

So Spamann, everyone is the same deep down? I agree that if you were to crush and grind us all down that we are made of the same building blocks, but that is where our equality ends you sycophantic bitch! Each person’s mind is slightly different from the rest. Each person perceives the world in different ways. Even modern psychology which you probably disregard as evil due to your stupid religion shows that emotional and cognitive development varies through genetic interaction with the environment. But you’re too hung up on painting the world with your giant retarded Desteni brush to see that for yourself. But just in case, I’m not making point clear enough consider the following:

[See Nova How the Brain Works clip]

In LLCraver’s video on selfhonesty, she makes her case that we have been conditioned with regular honesty through the system: Parents, schools, society, etc. She describes this conditioning as the policeman in our heads. She claims that one should throw away this policeman. However, she is only getting rid of one policeman for another. Desteni’s Self-honesty is simply Desteni’s new policeman. Of course the old Desteni bag of tricks justifies the new policeman because it is doing what is best for all. Sadly, Desteni just continues to fail at implementing what is best for all – right Miss Craver? Is Desteni practicing the Equal Money System right now on some level? Oh wait that’s right you’re waiting for it to arrive out of the sky like Jesus.

In real self honesty, your participation with the tools of the system is just a flimsy excuse to continue deriving energy from your cults special quest and feeling special while claiming that you are not. On a side note, I like how you have thrown away your books as an image of appearing smart by replacing them with glasses. You must be a Desteni rocket scientist now. But at least you decided not to shove the camera up your nose in this video – and for that I thank you. She further makes her case that normal morals and judgments of what is right and wrong are outflows of social programming. Whereas, Self-honesty has some ambiguous sanctified place due to considering what is hurting and helping others. However, Miss Craver, that is how normal morals and judgments got started. I fail to see here how you are really doing anything different. But, I think Miss Craver likes to think that she is on the cutting edge of cognitive processing and understanding through her insight about firing the policeman in her head. However, Miss Craver you are several decades behind on the research: 

[See the Century of Self Clip]

And that is exactly the kind of nothing Poolman is counting on in order to re program you to buy his products. In this way you’ll buy his books, take part in his money scam, and whatever other nonsense he will conjure up in the future. He will strip away your identity until nothing is left and then fill the void with a clone of himself. And then when he done mindfucking you, youll smile and ask for seconds. Very ingenious in some ways but just plain sloppy in the execution.

In conclusion Desteni’s self honesty is as hallow as a bubble and twice as empty. It is simply another gimmick in a long line of gimmicks to make those who use it think that they doing something astounding while not backing up their words with anything real. They claim that they only deal with the physical but in reality the only outflows of their work are spouting Desteni metaphysical nonsense, self writing, isolating themselves, supporting the Desteni infrastructure, stamping out real common sense and valid doubts, and throwing shit at everyone else while wallowing in it.  

If Desteni were to work as it is supposed to, then there would be no structural mechanisms which would lead members to become attached to the group and their fuhrer. The group and its members would be participating in a real rudimentary equal money system rather than some doomed unequal money scam. They would be doing what is best for all by getting off their asses, getting outside, and providing real examples of helping others – even if these examples are just temporary solutions. But here is the real reason why Destonians don’t help the starving masses. It is because they are too concerned with themselves.

However, Desteni has blacklisted charity and events towards providing real relief as a band aid solution. But the sad truth is that they are creating further cognitive patterns of such twisted behavior while feeling justified at the same time. The patterns of the Desteni Mind Construct will only allow one to feel easier about such contradictions. Given enough time, stamping out doubt and pushing through the fear that you are being conned on a grand scale becomes child’s play. But, I can’t totally dismiss Desteni as being totally worthless. It certainly serves the function of creating an online club for delusional idiots. But many of these new age style groups serve a similar function. Desteni tries very hard to make itself appear original, but simply fails in the execution.